Rifled BBs

[steyraug223]

Due to my natural curiosity I am always trying to work out ways to increase the effective range of the airsoft. Some ideas that have come to mind is an increase in the weight of the BB, or a increase in FPS. These can't work due to the increase in risk. However has anyone ever heard of a rifled BB? I am picturing a 45-70govt or similarly shaped round (blunt tip, fat and long) that would be scaled down to 6mm. The round would have to be hollow, or made of a light weight plastic so it could be solid, to avoid an increase in the weight. Also hopup would not be a possibility, but instead rifling could be used.

Any ideas?

[Whiskey11]

Due to my natural curiosity I am always trying to work out ways to increase the effective range of the airsoft. Some ideas that have come to mind is an increase in the weight of the BB, or a increase in FPS. These can't work due to the increase in risk. However has anyone ever heard of a rifled BB? I am picturing a 45-70govt or similarly shaped round (blunt tip, fat and long) that would be scaled down to 6mm. The round would have to be hollow, or made of a light weight plastic so it could be solid, to avoid an increase in the weight. Also hopup would not be a possibility, but instead rifling could be used.

Any ideas?

The only way for any finned or rifled round to work in Airsoft is to drastically increase power to compensate for the lack of hop.  Otherwise, we are talking about very short range.  That doesnt even bring up the fact that the rounds would have to be hand loaded into magazines, and realisticly speaking, many people dont like loading midcaps and standards, let alone a real cap with plastic rounds that have to be inserted correctly to fire correctly, for what would be minimal in effect and an increase in cost to the end user.  What we have, ballistic wise, is actually decent accuracy wise, and range wise damn nice.  If you dont like the accuracy of your BB's now, get a heavier weight, tightbore, or better hop up rubber and nub and work on increasing shot to shot consitency FPS wise.

[axisofoil]

If you want to see what it takes to make a 6mm round rifled and accurate... look no further than your less hot loads of .22.

To imprint rifling onto a round, it takes a huge amount of power (relative to the amount of power used in airsoft at least).
Hopup works better than rifling for low-power situations... just ask RAP4 about their bullet-shaped paintballs and how much of a flop that concept was... when flatline type barrels (same thing as hopup) could outrange it.

quite simply, you don't need to axially stabilize (using rifling and spin) a round with less than 5J of energy (suuuper hot airsoft guns). or even significantly higher amounts of energy than that.

[steyraug223]

just ask RAP4 about their bullet-shaped paintballs and how much of a flop that concept was...

actually I got the idea from the RAP4, though I hadn't had a chance yet to play around with a RAP4 gun yet. I think this is yet another indication that it is just time for me to get a simunitions gun.

[Ganef]

There is a reason that when mil guys go out with simunitions they have Corpsman on standby. If you get a gun that shoots simunitions, have fun by yourself, because the first person you shoot will never play with you again.

They had rifled barrels for GBBs back a few years ago. But found that it only made a difference with pistol barrels and a minor one at that. You just can't get the kind of range that you would want out of airsoft, my suggestion... change your tactics and mentality, pick up an AEG and focus more on trying to shoot a lot of people than trying to eek out on that one long range kill.

[steyraug223]

actually I am Navy, and I know all the safety limitations to simunitions. I would rather get a more realistic training enviroment and have to use proper PPE then play airsoft. That's just me though.

Also I use a AEG, I have a CA M14 Match length rifle. The reason I even care about distance is because I am frustrated with having 15ft more range then someone using a m4 or AK (when the effective ranges of said weapons differs rather greatly) and I think that having some true range would make the sport better. Failing that more CQB play.

[Ganef]

Some people that I have played with who were virgins to airsoft but have used sims said that the level of realism just because you don't have to wear PPE overshadowed the minor range difference between the two platforms.

You just can't get the kind of range you want and still be non-lethal, that is just the physics of it. You need to change the way you think about airsoft, or start incorporating other training(real shooting competition) to satisfy the long range portion of your experience.

[dismount]

why would you want long range anyway, up close and personal is where it is at.

[steyraug223]

why would you want long range anyway, up close and personal is where it is at.

I have to date only played one place that truly satisfied that urge for close in CQB action and they are closed now. (Statewide airsoft in downtown PHX) The reason I want more range is because I hate the 200 foot range where you can see the enemy and you cannot hit them. It just really frustrates me.

[Smoking ACE]

well 200 ft is a long way for airsoft, however my rifle has a range of around 160 ft but it is not accurate at that range.....its tought  if you want that kind of range need a sniper that shoots at 600 fps cuz most places wont allow any aeg's over 400 fps.

[axisofoil]

well 200 ft is a long way for airsoft, however my rifle has a range of around 160 ft but it is not accurate at that range.....its tought  if you want that kind of range need a sniper that shoots at 600 fps cuz most places wont allow any aeg's over 400 fps.

fps is NOT the same thing as effective range.

[carbon14c]

why would you want long range anyway, up close and personal is where it is at.

The reason I want more range is because I hate the 200 foot range where you can see the enemy and you cannot hit them. It just really frustrates me.

this was said in another thread, but the ideal environment for an airsoft match/op wouldnt have too many open areas like this... i mean, ideally there would be some cover and you should be able to close that distance up a bit


so in my opinion, the field would be the root of this problem! fix the field, everyone is happy

[Ganef]

why would you want long range anyway, up close and personal is where it is at.

The reason I want more range is because I hate the 200 foot range where you can see the enemy and you cannot hit them. It just really frustrates me.

this was said in another thread, but the ideal environment for an airsoft match/op wouldnt have too many open areas like this... i mean, ideally there would be some cover and you should be able to close that distance up a bit


so in my opinion, the field would be the root of this problem! fix the field, everyone is happy

This is true. High concentrations of brush cause the same problems as effective range problems. You can see people and shoot at them through the bushes but they don't count hits because your bbs only marginally penetrate.

The best fields are MOUT and large rocky areas, where the terrain and cover are solid and dispersed. This is hard to find, though.

[Black Fox]

Rifled BBs - Someone tried making rifled BBs in Japan 20 years ago.  They looked like Civil War bullets, round nose, back end hollow, outer back end had rifling groves and muzzle loaded.  Didn't work too well for some reason.

Finned BBs - Another one that was made was a BB with a short stem on the back with fins.  Very, very accurate but range was no greater than a standard BB.  These were used in bolt action rifles only and muzzle loaded.

Rifled Barrels - Great for pistols.  Accuracy is very good up to 10 yards.  Beyond 15 yards they suck.

To get the range you're looking at you need a velocity level of about 450 fps.  I played that in Japan with 0.36 BBs.  I loved it!  Average engagement range 40 yards, max effective range 70 yards max range 90 yards.  Bush offered no sanctuary, you found real cover.  And when you were shot at, BBs passing by your head buzzed like a bee, vegetation was scattered in the wind, bark on tree flew into the air and dirt burst from the ground.  It definitely added to the pucker factor. [smilie=armata_pdt_12.gif]   Two thing you did to protect yourself, make sure you had a face mask and never charge a position.

[axisofoil]

Rifled BBs - Someone tried making rifled BBs in Japan 20 years ago.  They looked like Civil War bullets, round nose, back end hollow, outer back end had rifling groves and muzzle loaded.  Didn't work too well for some reason.

Finned BBs - Another one that was made was a BB with a short stem on the back with fins.  Very, very accurate but range was no greater than a standard BB.  These were used in bolt action rifles only and muzzle loaded.

Rifled Barrels - Great for pistols.  Accuracy is very good up to 10 yards.  Beyond 15 yards they suck.

To get the range you're looking at you need a velocity level of about 450 fps.  I played that in Japan with 0.36 BBs.  I loved it!  Average engagement range 40 yards, max effective range 70 yards max range 90 yards.  Bush offered no sanctuary, you found real cover.  And when you were shot at, BBs passing by your head buzzed like a bee, vegetation was scattered in the wind, bark on tree flew into the air and dirt burst from the ground.  It definitely added to the pucker factor. [smilie=armata_pdt_12.gif]   Two thing you did to protect yourself, make sure you had a face mask and never charge a position.

... A lot of us STILL play like that.
And, you can get that range easily with less fps, just have to have everything else be high quality. lol.