Headshots

[Uchiha Itachi]

I do not intentionally shoot people in the head, even if it's all I have. I'd rather get shot then knock out a tooth or cause damage. Nor do I intentionally destroy others equipment since it's a game.

You know it can cause damage to the various parts of the head. So much so eye protection and lower face protection are becoming mandatory due to loosing restrictions on FPS. It's reckless and stupid in the name of having fun.

deathbydanish:

I've met quite a few people that do it intentionally. Either because they believe the person is cheating and wants them to call their hits, or just being a prick with an ego. I roll "spraying" into this as well.

[deathbydanish]

I do not intentionally shoot people in the head, even if it's all I have. I'd rather get shot then knock out a tooth or cause damage. Nor do I intentionally destroy others equipment since it's a game.

You know it can cause damage to the various parts of the head. So much so eye protection and lower face protection are becoming mandatory due to loosing restrictions on FPS. It's reckless and stupid in the name of having fun.

deathbydanish:

I've met quite a few people that do it intentionally. Either because they believe the person is cheating and wants them to call their hits, or just being a prick with an ego. I roll "spraying" into this as well.

I think I heard some spraying going on in today's game. It sounded pretty nasty, but from what I heard it sounded that the receiving party was engaging in some really obvious cheating.

[Uchiha Itachi]

I think I heard some spraying going on in today's game. It sounded pretty nasty, but from what I heard it sounded that the receiving party was engaging in some really obvious cheating.

Spraying is just as bad. Given you can hit someone in the face multiple times with a single burst, or cause issues players since their intentionally trying to hurt them. Just because some are cheating isn't a free pass to cheat/break the general rules of the game to get even. Playing in an open game, like the one you played at, this should be expected of people to cheat. One to many rounds have flown past me in staging areas, too many 550+FPS AEGs(or 410), and too many arrogant tools trying to be rambo has caused me to stop attending big games and sell nearly all my gear. It's not worth it to get wrapped up.


In essence...dirtying one's own hands to stop others from doing something doesn't make one right. It makes one worse than the principle.

[axisofoil]

By the way, I'm not sure if I made it clear... my two little stories were instances of the only two (In my opinion) situations in which headshots should ever occur.

A shot intended to hit another part of the body, or when only the head is present as a target.

Nor do I intentionally destroy others equipment.

Just to be clear, I did not intentionally shoot his sight. The whole +/- 4 inches for a shot where there's gusting wind caused the bb to hit the sight.

But I will shoot at a presented target. I only fire in semi-auto though. ESPECIALLY when it's for a headshot (which is, once again, ONLY when NOTHING else is exposed).

im going to assume that was up at mt. ord?

Nah, it was up at our game in Prescott. MHA hosts them all the time, you know.

Through his red dot, and into his nose?

What?

That story sucks.

He had one of those cheapy $20 ones that everybody used (because they work great until some @$$hole shoots a hole through it).
But yeah, the shot went clean through the sight's aperture window and hit the bridge of his nose.

[TheBoy988]

Well Mr. Axisofoil. I think you are a meanie head noob hunter for shooting his sights out! You couldn't have scooted over a little!? Good lord! I wear eye protection to protect my eye NOW i have to get eye protection for my optics when i'm around you?

lol welcome to airsoft guys. Shit happens. This is why you spend 100$ on EoTech replicas rather then the real thing. I will shoot for the head if thats all i have.

[Ghillieman]

last week all the guy gave me was a head shot so I took it from a bad shooting position. I didn't hear him call the hit so I sprayed another 10 rounds his way. Unfortunately 3 or 4 hit him right in the face. After a short discussion over the issue I called myself out becase I'm not into playing to hurt people. I've taken a lot of rounds to the face but it's simply part of the game. I'll take it if there is no other shot available. This is a game of honor and integrity and I think that all should be taken into account when picking your shots.

[deathbydanish]

I think I heard some spraying going on in today's game. It sounded pretty nasty, but from what I heard it sounded that the receiving party was engaging in some really obvious cheating.

Spraying is just as bad. Given you can hit someone in the face multiple times with a single burst, or cause issues players since their intentionally trying to hurt them. Just because some are cheating isn't a free pass to cheat/break the general rules of the game to get even. Playing in an open game, like the one you played at, this should be expected of people to cheat. One to many rounds have flown past me in staging areas, too many 550+FPS AEGs(or 410), and too many arrogant tools trying to be rambo has caused me to stop attending big games and sell nearly all my gear. It's not worth it to get wrapped up.


In essence...dirtying one's own hands to stop others from doing something doesn't make one right. It makes one worse than the principle.

Unfortunately I heard the word "referee" being mentioned when a new airsoft establishment was being discussed. The consensus seemed to be that it'll be a cold day in hell before referees in airsoft games at least up here will become the norm. So how do you propose that the silent majority engages this problem of cheaters without having to resort to referees?

I know that most game organizers will probably have a chat with the offending individual regarding their behavior and that further examples of the offending behavior will be cause for a ban from future games. But I've seen that in the culture of airsoft it seems to have become an unwritten rule that if someone is being an obvious cheater and not calling their hits, that this kind of retaliation is expected. I've seen what happens when you have an offender who consistently engages in cheating and very little is done to discourage their behavior, they become used to it and indeed more brazen, even after numerous chats from various people. Outside of this unwritten rule, how do you deal with someone like this who does not respond to intervention from game organizers or even bans?

[Uchiha Itachi]

Unfortunately I heard the word "referee" being mentioned when a new airsoft establishment was being discussed. The consensus seemed to be that it'll be a cold day in hell before referees in airsoft games at least up here will become the norm. So how do you propose that the silent majority engages this problem of cheaters without having to resort to referees?

I know that most game organizers will probably have a chat with the offending individual regarding their behavior and that further examples of the offending behavior will be cause for a ban from future games. But I've seen that in the culture of airsoft it seems to have become an unwritten rule that if someone is being an obvious cheater and not calling their hits, that this kind of retaliation is expected. I've seen what happens when you have an offender who consistently engages in cheating and very little is done to discourage their behavior, they become used to it and indeed more brazen, even after numerous chats from various people. Outside of this unwritten rule, how do you deal with someone like this who does not respond to intervention from game organizers or even bans?

Why is the "referee" notion considered bad to most veteran airsofters? Trust.....

The inherent problem with airsoft is you rely on trusting other people. It's been made obvious through paintball you can not trust people, that are marked, to be honest. Airsoft's basic tenant is trusting people will be honest. So, by allowing refs you acknowledge airsofters are no better than paintballers and can not be trusted. The problem is, airsofters already don't trust most newer players given large numbers of them are paintballers jumping ship for either monetary or attitude reasons. Adding refs would just be the final nail in the coffin for the honor of the game.

There is also the problem of compromising. Compromising is terrible, you allow the best of two things to be made into 1 mediocre that can't compete. Any merging of paintball style games/organization in airsoft does this and vice verse.  So don't.

Would you really have a problem at a paid to play field if a referee only ref'd when a problem person was apparent with no knowledge you were being watched. Isn't that what game organizers do now? The only difference is they can legally BAN them from the business for breaking the rules.

Traditions are notorious playgrounds for foul play and manipulation. I have no respect for traditions if they simple promote problems. Do I really need to say how sh*tty most airsofters accuracy is originally? Really so when partnered with windage, off center sights, hopup issues, BB deformities, and the like? Since when have biased opinions become facts to judge others?

I imagine the same as now. I haven't seen many teams posting open games, and the amount of games over the past few years as dropped drastically. If you control the flow of information to only trusted people, there isn't any reason to cater cheaters. Have a ruined game, but find a few good people, invite them to private games. So you have 1 bad game to get several good games. Then keep repeating the process as desired.

[Blestx1]

I'm not saying I shoot people in the dome on a daily basis. I was trying to get some ideas of what others thought. Is it shunned upon? Is it fair? And what most of you are saying is "if its the only shot I have, then I take it".

I live in Cochise County, and about 20 miles from the US/Mexico Border, I'm like the only white dude that lives down here lol, that's besides the point. but I want to have matches down here, I've got tons of people that are interested in air-soft in the Cochise county area, the only problem I have is no one is willing to have games held in this neck of the woods, so I'm taking the initiative to get a game going that everyone would enjoy, and I'm trying to come up with rules and notes on game play, what's acceptable and what not. so any input really is great.

For Example: The Air-soft Organizations such as Rebel Union, are they a subsidiary of Air-soft Arizona? And if so what does it take to be a subsidiary?

[axisofoil]

They're just a group of people that host games.
If you want to host a game... go on over to the local games/rsvp section... and put a game up.

Make sure you have an AO. Make sure that AO is outside of city limits. Make sure that AO is either public land, or get the written permission of the owner.

Make sure if it's national park type of public land that you let the rangers know you're planning a game.

Don't forget to post rules, times, dates, game scenarios etc.

Also, hop onto tucsonairsoftcoalition.com and invite some of those guys. They're a bit closer to ya. Make sure to talk to the guys from Yuma. lol.

[Blestx1]

OK cool. Thanks for the tips.

[VICTORIOUS]

I'm the one that ghillieman sprayed in the face. He was high on a hill behind an embankment and my team was pinned behind some scrub bushes down below just at the edge of his range. (we play in a desert setting). To my left was a crag going up the hill about four feet deep that led right up to a position about thirty feet to his right. My team kept him busy at that position as I ran up the orroyo. I got up there quicker than I expected, and was surprised how close we ended up being to each other. Now, I was basically in a ditch poking my head out when I took a shot at him. He returned fire in semi auto and hit me in the Upper chest, then ducked behind his bank and clicked to auto, and as i called the hit and started down the hill, he lifted his rifle over his head and sprayed the shit out of me to the point that I was yelling hit and still being shot at. My nose, lip, and cheek all had bleeding marks. I was hit in the glasses too. Ghillie felt terrible about what he did and called himself out, which was cool, but i was still irked at him blind firing at me while my rifle was held in the air and I was walking away. This is a situation that i hope everyone avoids. Spraying/blind shooting is not cool at all....you suck ghillie!! :x
I do shoot at heads if it is the only option, but usually in semi auto when they poke out over some creosotes or other cover. I routinely find myself at a standoff with dismount (a forum user) where we are basically trading shots at each others boonies, both of us know what the result will be if we are hit. No one likes to get shot in the face or neck, but it is an inherent risk. Shoot carefully everyone and remember that those little bbs can do great damage.

[nynone]

I use .25s when I play. They don't travel fast, but their impact is worse than someone firing back with .12s (I usually play with buddies who buy the cheap stuff haha). I know the damage that it can do, and we always say "no head shots allowed". But, we all know that if the head is the only part exposed, it will be shot at. That's part of the game though. If you're exposed, you will be shot at. Whether its just your crotch exposed, or just your hand on the ground, if it's exposed, it's going to be shot. Airsoft is just like real war, there's just no actual deaths.

In short, yes head shots happen. Are they allowed? Typically not. If you're playing where there's a rule against it, I'm sure it will be broken due to the natural instinct of returning fire.

[carbon14c]

im going to assume that was up at mt. ord?

Nah, it was up at our game in Prescott. MHA hosts them all the time, you know.

yeah, i actually realized that AFTER i wrote the reply lol


..but i was too lazy to go back and rectify it haha. we might come up this weekend if you guys are hosting  :lol: