New AF uniform

[delta_echo]

Army flyers are better anyways....

If "better" is defined as "slower" and "easier to hit" . Aw heck, I'm not even going for a pilot slot so I guess I shouldn't care too much.

[SilentDragon]

I know the Air Force is not as active (combat wise) as the the Marines, Army, and Navy.  But they do get some ground action.  My dad is a C-130 Gunship Hydraulics engineer and commander of his squadron.  Right now, he is living in an old Russian aircraft shelter in Afghanistan until his three months are up.  Since 9/11, he has been going back and forth to Afghanistan, spending as much as 6 months at a time.  Last Christmas was the only Christmas since 9/11 that he was able to have... then he left a week later.  He is assigned a rifle... and has to watch his step, because the abandoned base on the Outskirts of Aghanistan's hella mountainous region (impossible to land planes, and in a lot of cases, even choppers) is marked with live mines from previous wars.  Sure, he doesn't see death (at least that i know), but the AF deserves as much respect as the other branches.  I'm not saying that just to back my dad.  Yeah, the Marines, and Army, and the real G.I.'s should get the newest in camo design... i agree.  But please don't hate on the AF... they're NOT a bunch of pussies just because they don't kill with a rifle.  

Sorry for the off topic post... just my .02 cents.

[deathbydanish]

I would guess the new camo pattern would be good for Combat Controllers and Security Forces, AFAIK they're the closest thing to combat infantry the Air Force has.

[azsarge]

I would guess the new camo pattern would be good for Combat Controllers and Security Forces, AFAIK they're the closest thing to combat infantry the Air Force has.

Read my above post.

Silent Dragon, we appreciate your fathers service.  However, try to stay on topic.

[Lightning_Man]

I don't care about the relative merits of the uniform, I care that it cost money (probably a lot) to develop and is redundant any way you cut it.

[azsarge]

I don't care about the relative merits of the uniform, I care that it cost money (probably a lot) to develop and is redundant any way you cut it.

Which presents an interesting point.

I've seen several soldiers sporting the ACU before it was issued to them.  Think of all the money that's made from this alone.  I'm sure AAFES is rejoicing.

[Gantaliano Hoff]

I've seen several soldiers sporting the ACU before it was issued to them.  Think of all the money that's made from this alone.  I'm sure AAFES is rejoicing.

Mp doubt in my mind. But I bet I won't be seeing an issued pair for at least a year.

[deathbydanish]

Wait, do these new Air Force BDUs help occlude the IR signature of the person wearing them, as is the case with the USMC issue MCCUUs? Or are they just plain old 50/50 Nyco BDUs with a digital pattern slapped on because the Air Force doesn't want to be left out of the digital camo fad?

Edit: I just read Christian's post, it does seem much more logical for them to blend in with whatever unit they're attached to. At the very least it probably makes logistics in terms of gear and matching a lot easier if everyone has the same patterned IBA and helmet cover.

[delta_echo]

I've seen several soldiers sporting the ACU before it was issued to them.  Think of all the money that's made from this alone.  I'm sure AAFES is rejoicing.

Mp doubt in my mind. But I bet I won't be seeing an issued pair for at least a year.

Nope. Probably won't be seeing an issued pair until after graduation. Implementation is set to begin in 2007 with full implementation by 2011. I imagine they'll be throwing the standard woodland uniform at the academy for some time after in order to get rid of supplies, and I KNOW that means ROTC won't be getting them anytime soon. If they speed up implementation . . .well . . . I still don't think you or I are going to see them until after commissioning.

[stoneaglewolf]

I'm all for it if the soldiers like it. Thats what counts here. There are not field combat uniforms as much as a motivator for soldiers to feel better about themselves. I remember switching from the OG107's to the BDU's and we were very happy to switch. So with all the other branches changing it makes sense to change the AF uniform to keep the soldiers happy. I wouldn't what the Af guys to feel left behind and outdated nor would I want them to look like the Army guys. And if the pattern makes them feel safer on the job then great. I think this is more about motivation, self esteem, leadership/teamwork and espirt de corps. Aim High!

[azsarge]

I'm all for it if the soldiers like it. Thats what counts here. There are not field combat uniforms as much as a motivator for soldiers to feel better about themselves. I remember switching from the OG107's to the BDU's and we were very happy to switch. So with all the other branches changing it makes sense to change the AF uniform to keep the soldiers happy. I wouldn't what the Af guys to feel left behind and outdated nor would I want them to look like the Army guys. And if the pattern makes them feel safer on the job then great. I think this is more about motivation, self esteem, leadership/teamwork and espirt de corps. Aim High!

IMO, switching from OG107 to BDU was a step in the wrong direction.

The BDU pocket arrangement was all wrong.  The ACUs still didn't get the trouser pockets right!

The best pocket arrangement on an issue trouser is the Improved Aircrew Battle Dress Uniform (IABDU).  Similar to the ABDU, but with slight changes of pocket dimensions and non-melting zippers replacing the velcro pocket closure.  

If we could get the ACU shirt pockets, and IABDU trouser pockets, that would be the shit.

From what I gather, the Army Aviation Combat Uniform (ABDU in ACU pattern) will have the same shirt pockets as the current ABDU.

The AF just said FUKKIT! and kept the same pocket arrangment.  I think they could have been a bit more original.

edit:  let me snap some pics of my IABDUs for the hell of it.

[azsarge]

Here we go:
IABDU top:


Note the collar, which can be worn as a standard collar when not required.  For flight, refueling, or other potential burn situation, it is worn as shown.  The small slanted, rectangular piece is a velcroed hole for the AirWarrior colling System Vest (I've never worn one).  Also worth noting are the zippered pocket and front closures, and the fucked up velcro.  This is my oldest set, and the velcro is coming unstitched from the shirt.  

Not shown is the sleeve pocket, with a velcro flap for a pencil, black and red pen, and a zippered compartment for a wallet, personal items, etc.  (I put my SKOAL there )

The shoulders have flat seams and are reinforced for wear underneath the Surival Vest.

Trousers: right side

The top pocket has a zipper at the top.  The lower pocket closes with a zipper as well.  Here is some detail on the smallest pocket (used for writing instruments):

Left side

Note how the pocket opens from the front edge.  This becomes the TOP edge when sitting, and is VERY nice to have while in a helicopter!  

The lower pocket has another internal pocket, which holds a wallet perfectly, with no moving around.


And, finally, the bottom of the trousers:


Cinched-up by velcro.  When in Garrison, or in the hangar, they are worn bloused, like the BDU, ACU, DCU, etc.  When in flight, they are worn un-bloused, but cinched up around the boot by the velcro.

[stoneaglewolf]

Yeah I have the first pattern two piece woodland flight suit but it sucked.

Christian, are you sure you are talking about the OG107 two pocket green tuck in shirt. They were awful. They were two tight, buttons break off, and no expansion in the pockets. If you are talking about the Jungles then yes I agree the pockets were better slanted.

[azsarge]

Jungles, my mistake.

[KiLLaDaTa]

for everyones information the airforce is transitioning from the airforce you all talk about lazy bike pt tests and all your other countless knocks to a real ground fighting machine for one their basic trainning is real close as in within the next year is moving from 6 week BMT to 12 week and is basicaly a clone of the army's BMT get off the bus, here is your m-16 kinda thing another thing most of you fail to realize is the airforce is pounding ground they are acctually contracted out to do convoy security for the army and do a damn good job at it our security forces isnt just guarding the base anymore but going on viper missions house to house with marines army and their special forces the airforces fitness test isnt easy anymore granted not as hard as army but only a step away as for the new uniforms they are a great thing just a few highlights "Airmen’s feedback throughout the process was beneficial in adding new pockets on the uniform" The new uniform design is a pixilated tiger stripe with four soft earth tones consisting of tan, grey, green and blue. The ABU will have a permanent crease and will be offered in 50-50 nylon-cotton blend permanent press fabric eliminating the need for winter and summer weight uniforms.

as for having IR signatures the airforce makes wearing kevlar mandatory unlike the army which has an IR signature

and i really dont apreciate bashing of any US military group and all of your stereotypes are any of you in the airforce anyway? do any of you really know what its like this day and age? i cant get into specifics but the airforce is moving heavily towards being more "ground pounding" like your other branches. more and more AFSCs are being trainned the same as security forces before they deploy because they dont just see the shit they are in the shit too
hey why are people getting pissed about something that could save one of our soldiers lives?